So they got one. Whooo-hoo look at us, we wrote one script...wee-hee hee.
Agent Bat wrote:
Lachrymose wrote:All merely re-tellings of the Epics of Kirk....rehash for the youngsters. Classic stories shot-up with steroids. Feh!
Do explain. How was "The Best and Both Worlds" a re-telling of a Kirk epic? Do give a point-by-point analysis, please.
"The Best of Both Worlds" (2-parts). "Darmok". "Chain of Command" (2-parts). "The Inner Light". "I, Borg". "All Good Things..." "Star Trek: First Contact". And those were just the few I came up with off the top of my head.
Sure, the first two seasons of TNG
were Kirk re-hashes. Then Season 3 hit. Yar died. The Borg were introduced. Roddenberry
died and new blood took over the series. TNG
came into its own. Then we had DS9
, which was not a damn thing
like Kirk's series. From Season 3 of TNG
to Season 7 were four years
of non-Kirk and non-Kirk-like stories. DS9
had seven years
(minus "Trials and Tribble-ations", the anniversary episode). Since these overlapped, we'll say this was seven or eight years
of stories not like Kirk at all
Dude, seriously, claiming that everything
Picard, Sisko, Janeway or Archer did were just re-hashes of Kirk is pure, unadulterated, damn-fool stubbornness
. Go back and watch the series yourself to see what I mean.
Or, you could do as I asked and prove me wrong. Point-by-point. I dare
zoldos wrote:No one voted for Janeway or Archer LOL
Minnie d'Arc wrote:It's a bit of a shame about no-one voting for Jonathan Archer. I think if Enterprise had had as long a run as TNG, DS9 or Voyager things might have been different. Some of the situations in which Archer found himself in the Expanse, and the resultant decisions, were hideously tough. He found solutions which even Kirk might have blanched at, in the name of a dream, an ideal, with no safety net of a Federation to fall back on.
He was a great captain.
I agree with your first statements; Archer was unorthodox - in good ways and
bad - and Enterprise
probably would've been remembered as an awesome show, had they had more time to tell more stories and kept Manny Coto
as the lead writer from then on, as was planned. I wouldn't say he was a "great" captain, though; that's a bit of a stretch, to me. Sure, Enterprise
had some damn good episodes - "Damage"
, "Breaking the Ice"
immediately spring to mind - but they also had a slew
of stinkers during Seasons 1 and 2 - piss-poor episodes such as, say, "Acquisition"
and "Dear Doctor"
, which (while hilarious, in "Acquisition's" case) were about as close to unintentional character assassination as a writer could get without pasting a "kick me" sign on the back of every Enterprise
blue jumpsuit. Hell, Chuck Sonnenberg
makes a damn good case that Archer (a.k.a. "Dutchess") is really a street-crazy Starfleet hired last-minute because their new starship desperately needed a commanding officer ASAP. (I realize that isn't the truth - Archer had been working on the Warp 5 engine since his father first thought it up - but damn
, if Sonnenberg isn't persuasive
Please don't misunderstand me! It isn't
Archer! It's the writers
(specifically the show-runners, Rick Berman & Brannon Braga)! They wrote Archer - hell, they wrote all
characters this way (example: here's Phlox's character assassination
)! - as morons and hypocrites (for example: compare Archer's decision in "Fortunate Son"
to his decision in "Silent Enemy"
), when they weren't just writing outright awful
episodes (again, "Acquisition"
) or outright offensive
episodes (like "Unexpected"
, which starts
with the interesting idea of a pregnant male, quickly slid into a horrible
episode where [spoiler]somebody fucking
rapes "Trip" and it's played off for
laughs[/spoiler]). Sure, there were occasional good episodes - once again, I point to "Regeneration"
(which was a damn good sequel to "Star Trek: First Contact"
. The series really
didn't get better until the war stories from Season 3 (beginning with "Anzati Prime"
, which were inspired by the superb handling of the Dominion War from Deep Space Nine
, though - like GWB - they rushed into that story without an exit strategy and had to leave the ending
up to poor Manny Coto to deal with before he could get to writing his
brilliant episodes), and hiring Manny Coto as the series' new lead writer for Season 4 only improved the series moreso.
zoldos wrote:Maybe so, but IMO the show itself sucked except for the "temporal cold war" episodes.....
Exactly. Before "Anzati Prime", Enterprise
was absolutely horrible
. After "Anzati Prime", though, the series got much better. It's too bad most of the viewers left after the first two seasons; modern Trek
series usually take two seasons to really get going, but I think all the hype about Enterprise
being "new and improved
!" from the get-go, then disappointing Trekkies by not
being so just left too many feeling jaded toward the franchise as a whole.
Minnie d'Arc wrote:
But we're voting on the captain, not the show...
Ah, but can
we, given how the series and their starring captains are so intrinsically tied?